I saw the headline this morning and couldn't believe what I was seeing. Damn hypocrites!! Then again, I'm glad they are gonna do it to show the world who they really are. This helps our cause greatly and reveals them for who they truly are. I knew that they were gonna do it. I predicted this about 2 months ago and they didn't let me down. They can't resist the money. Amazing that us normal folks have more revelation and are better at predicting the future than God's supposed Prophet, Seer and Revelator!!
They are now officially in the world and of the world. Welcome!! Here are some quotes from the Tribune article that explain how they are going to get around the fact that there will be alcohol being served in their mall. Then I will follow that up with some great quotes by current Apostles and the beloved Hinckster regarding the use of alcohol. This is mind blowing!! I would say that they are getting bolder and bolder in their actions. I guess if Hinckley can tell a woman to wear only one earring and she obeys, then serving alcohol in the name of God is an easy one!!
I started my journey 3-4 months ago but if I hadn't, I would have started it now after reading this article. First they buy the malls, now they serve alcohol. I even have a "TBM" relative that today said, "this is it for me." They are writing letters today to the First Presidency and their Bishop. They are furious!! Anyway, here are some of those quotes:
Salt Lake Tribune article.
The LDS Church has opened the door to alcohol sales at its downtown mall project. But forget Sunday shopping.
In an unexpected move for a church that eschews alcohol, LDS Church spokesman Dale Bills said Friday restaurants that will open as part of the redevelopment of Crossroads Plaza and ZCMI Center malls will be allowed to seek liquor licenses.
For residents who may have feared the church was on its way to "Vaticanize" downtown by buying up property like the malls, the alcohol decision is a show of tolerance, say observers.
It's also an economic decision: Vibrant downtowns need nightlife.(You see, it's all about the money, "an economic decision.")
The church says it wants to create a vibrant, 24-7 environment in its new project,
Because the church preaches against liquor consumption, it is distancing itself from the future restaurant operations. The church will sell land for the restaurants to an outside developer.
And there won't be any private clubs or bars opening on the blocks.
"A limited number of high-quality restaurant tenants who will operate on land not owned by the church may apply for licenses to serve alcoholic beverages in accordance with existing state regulations," Bills told The Salt Lake Tribune.
Friday was the first time the church has acknowledged the Sunday and alcohol arrangements. The announcement came first during an interview Mayor Rocky Anderson conducted with Bills and church architect Bill Williams on KCPW's "Midday Metro" radio program.
When Bills said it was the church's "goal" to allow restaurants to serve wine, Anderson responded: "That's going to be good news for a lot of people in this community."
So basically, these hypocritical scumbags are going to sell the land that each restaurant is on to the individual restaurant so that they can "officially say", it's not our land. They must think that people are real dumb asses and won't be able to figure this one out. Then again, most "TBM's" will probably say, "SEE, they are doing the right thing, selling the land so that it won't be Church property."
I guess it would be okay then if I sold my basement to a bar or a brothel. Yes, it would be in my house, but it wouldn't be my property. I'm sure my Bishop would be fine with that. Let's get real guys!! These GA's are more cunning than the Devil himself but wait, maybe it's the Devils Church after all and he guides them? Oh well, I'm just amazed at the latest current events regarding these hypocrites and I'm just glad that I got the hell out of there and don't have to defend their actions any longer. However, I can't wait to talk to my "TBM" friend who will defend the Church at any cost, that should be a fun and delightsome conversation. Isn't it wonderful?!!
Anyway, here are quotes by current GA's to back up my point of how the Church feels/felt about alcohol. **warning, you may laugh uncontrollably**:
Dallin H. Oaks, “Brother’s Keeper,” Ensign, Nov. 1986, 20
Wouldn't’t it be wonderful if this same attitude of looking after the interests of others governed Latter-day Saints who are making a profit from the sale or promotion of alcoholic beverages? Consider the terrible effects of alcohol. Alcohol-related accidents are the leading cause of death of those under twenty-five. The physical, social, and financial effects of alcohol ruin marriages and family life. By dulling inhibitions, alcohol leads to untold numbers of crimes and moral transgressions. Alcohol is the number one addictive drug in our day.
The consumption of alcohol is increasing among youth. Targeting young audiences, advertisers portray beer and wine as joyful, socially desirable, and harmless. Producers are promoting new types of alcoholic beverages as competitors in the huge soft-drink market. Grocery and convenience stores and gas stations stock alcoholic beverages side by side with soda pop. Can Christians who are involved in this commerce be indifferent to the physical and moral effects of the alcohol from which they are making their profits? (Hey, that's a great question Mr. Oaks, now answer it for us.)
Russell M. Nelson, “Joy Cometh in the Morning,” Ensign, Nov. 1986, 67
In 1833 the Prophet Joseph Smith received the Word of Wisdom by revelation. It includes these simple directives: We are not to drink alcohol, tea, or coffee, and we are not to use tobacco. Prophets in our generation and in this conference have told us also to avoid harmful drugs. Now medical science increasingly confirms the physical benefits of compliance with these teachings.
The damaging effects of alcohol are so widely known, additional comment is hardly needed. Harm inflicted by alcohol has been demonstrated, for example, by a study of the relationship between alcohol consumption among expectant mothers and the birth weight of their newborn infants. Findings published from the U. S. National Institutes of Health disclosed that consumption of one to two alcoholic drinks a day was associated with a substantially increased risk of producing a growth-retarded infant (see James L. Mills, et. al., “Maternal Alcohol consumption and Birth Weight,” Journal of the American Medical Association, 12 Oct. 1984, pp. 1875–79).
Ezra Taft Benson, “Satan’s Thrust—Youth,” Ensign, Dec. 1971, 53
The Church must not compromise standards before popular demands. Surely tobacco, coffee, and alcohol users have been alienated by uncompromising standards as much as today’s rocking miniskirts.
Using life as a laboratory, we can observe and study the lives of others as we might through a microscope. Observe that the man of God is a happy man. The hedonist, who proclaims “Do your thing,” who lives for sinful, so-called pleasure, is never happy. Behind his mask of mock gaiety lurks the inevitable tragedy of eternal death. Haunted by its black shadow, he trades the useful, happy life for the bleak forgetfulness of drugs, alcohol, sex, and rock.
Russell M. Nelson, “Addiction or Freedom,” Ensign, Nov. 1988,
Alcohol
There is mounting concern worldwide over the consumption of alcohol. The U.S. government estimates that 10.6 million adults are alcoholics and that one family in four is troubled by alcohol. It is a factor in half of all the nation’s traffic deaths.
Last year, a tragic milestone was reached. More Americans had been killed from alcohol-related motor vehicle accidents (1,350,000) than had been killed in all the wars America has ever fought (1,156,000).
Dallin H. Oaks, “Be Not Deceived,” Ensign, Nov. 2004, 43
And we must never do anything to drive away that Spirit. Specifically, we should avoid pornography, alcohol, tobacco and drugs, and always, always avoid violations of the law of chastity.
Four B's for Boys
Gordon B. Hinckley, “Four B’s for Boys,” Ensign, Nov. 1981, 40
...be so shortsighted as to indulge in the use of alcohol, tobacco, and drugs. It simply is not smart to do...
...and short-circuit your future? Beer and other forms of alcohol will do you no good. Their use will be expensive...
Look to the Future
Gordon B. Hinckley, “Look to the Future,” Ensign, Nov. 1997, 67
...But there is so much more to do among them. Alcohol and drugs literally destroy many of them. We must do...
...the family in America and across the world. Drugs and alcohol are taking a terrible toll, which is not likely to...
That We May Touch Heaven
Thomas S. Monson, “That We May Touch Heaven,” Ensign, Nov. 1990, 45
...mind and spirit. Hard drugs, wrongful use of prescription drugs, alcohol, coffee, tea, and tobacco products destroy your physical, mental, and...
...spiritual well-being. Any form of alcohol, including beer, is harmful to your spirit and your body...
Be Ye Clean"
Gordon B. Hinckley, “Be Ye Clean,” Ensign, May 1996, 46
...things and has warned us against them. Stay away from alcohol, my brethren. Never get involved in a so-called beer...
...divine. It is totally wrong for you to partake of alcohol or drugs that are forbidden by the law. Be clean...
The Joy of Hope Fulfilled
M. Russell Ballard, “The Joy of Hope Fulfilled,” Ensign, Nov. 1992, 31(He was talking about a man he knew, not himself....LOL) Wishful Thinking eh?
I was taken with the practice of free drugs, free love, free fun, and the rest of the world be damned. Beginning with my first drink of alcohol, I began to slowly deteriorate. After alcohol, other drugs were that much easier to use. In order to take drugs, you must become a good liar. You learn to do whatever it takes to conceal your behavior from others.
Gordon B. Hinckley, “Why We Do Some of the Things We Do,” Ensign, Nov. 1999, 52
Avoid alcohol as you would a loathsome disease. Beer will do to you what hard liquor will do. Each contains alcohol in varying amounts.
Anyway, their are literally hundreds of references on the Churches website talking about how evil alcohol is but yet they will allow it in their mall but it won't be their property. Okay, so you aren't responsible. I wish I could have used that defense when I was a "TBM" to explain away any questionable behavior. To me, the Mormon Church has just lost complete credibility for their teachings on the Word of Wisdom and specifically alcohol. It may be a while before we hear anyone from the Church preach about the dangers of alcohol. Then again, they are so arrogant, Hinckley will probably say in the next conference, "We did the right thing selling that property..." After all, it was Brigham Young who opened the first bar in Salt Lake and Joseph had a bar in his front room until Emma went crazy and made him chose between her and the bar. Porter Rockwell was the bartender which I love.
Smoking and drinking Prophets link
So you see, there is a pretty strong history of the Church pretending to be against things that they really indulge in, especially alcohol and tobacco and this goes all the way back to good ol' Joseph Smith. I would love everyone's comments on this. I'm not saying that I'm against a restaurant serving alcohol, I talking specifically about the Mormon Church serving alcohol at their mall when you can't even get a Coke or Pepsi at BYU. Anyway, this turned out great for those of us that are no longer in the Church.
What a cult!! Do as we say, not as we do or you will be greatly punished but of course we only punish with love and concern!! Is it just me, or is this cult getting more evil by the day?!!
Samuel the Utahnite
16 comments:
This is very informative. Some time ago we saw a program on TV showing how some rich Mormons gradually bought out the casinos in Las Vegas, justifying their actions in saying that previuosly the casinos were owned by Criminals. Members of the Church are employed in the casinos. The Church teaches against gambling of any kind. so these people are living off gambling!! or not??
That again shows a hypocritical double standard.
I have only recently found your site and dont know what the letters TBM mean. can you please tell me
Thank you Heike Winchester, in Australia
First of all, even if these things happened, it isn't the mormon church that's doing this. Some mormons try to justify things in crazy ways, but that isn't the church that is doing it. You can't judge the church based on what some people, that say that they are mormon, do. What mall are you even talking about? How do you know that the church owns it or if a member of the church owns it, there's a big difference.
The evidence that you posted against them clearly states that they are distancing themselves from it by selling these resturants the land so they can have their businesses, but clearly the Mormon church is not saying they condone it. They are being tolerant. It is not like all people in Utah are Mormons you know! And it would be wrong for the mormon church to stop businesses from doing business. I think that they did the most honest thing that could be done in that situation.
I am curious as to what you did in your life that has made you feel that you need to tear down the Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints in order to make you feel better?
Mormons ARE hypocrites. The gambling issue is like me saying how I'm against blood sports while at the same time organising fox hunts or bull fighting.
Also the very fact that Mormons condemn what the Bible permits shows they are not true Christians. Jesus turned water into wine as his first miracle at a wedding feast. Mormons will tell you that was just grape juice when the Bible refers to wine. If that's the case, how did Noah get drunk on grape juice???? And why did the Apostle Paul encourage Timothy to drink a little wine on account of his stomach? The Bible condems alcohol ABUSE no alcohol itself. Another example of a religious group putting their own teachings ahead of what the Bible says.
Mormonism is a very dark religion and if any one of their members shows even a SLIGHT interest in the real teachings of the Bible, they get moved on to an entirely different area. I know from personal experience from when I've met them in their ministry work here in Spain.
I'm a bit confused at how forbidding their members to drink alcohol makes Mormonism a very dark religion. I can understand why you would claim that it is an incorrect belief, but that it makes them evil? Seriously, come on!
how dare you judge an entire church on the actions of a few members that went astray. who do you think you are telling people this type of stuff when clearly you have no idea what you are talking about. every church has a few members that give it a bad name and reputation but i cant believe you have sunk as low as to make an entire website bashing a religion you yourself once took part of. i feel sorry for you that you feel the need to bad mouth an entire church just because of a handleful of members. Clearly no one is perfect and that surely includes you and everyone strays from the straight and narrow from time to time. you make me sick and i hope you realize that this is the lowest of lows, even for someone that has no life like yourself.
"How dare I judge an entire church on the actions of a few members that went astray?"
Uh...when I'm talking about your head cheese Gordon B. Hinckley, giving the approval for booze to be served in Jesus Christ's new malls; I think I'm perfectly justified. Did you even bother to read the post?
Did you not read all of the quotes I posted, that are from your beloved Prophets and Apostles, condemning alcohol. Spencer W. Kimball strongly condemns both those that sell alcohol and those that buy it and even compares the sellers to the mob...and those are his words not mine.
Are you proud that Jesus Christ's new multi-billion dollar malls will be serving booze?
Also, when the members of said church/cult, that I'm criticizing, happen to be the head leaders, that call themselves and pretend to be Prophets, Seers and Revelators of some God; I think it matters a great deal. Don't you? Are you just a blind follower, like they demand you need to be?
Did I ever claim to be perfect? Do your Prophets and Apostles claim to be infallible, in that they can NEVER lead you astray? Yes, they do, over and over...so don't tell me they are just men, because they themselves claim that they aren't just men.
In fact, they'd be pissed and upset at the characterizations of you and many others, that they are "just men who make mistakes." They certainly don't agree with your opinion and even claim that if they attempt to lead the Saints astray, God will literally step in and remove them.
Ballard says to "keep your eyes riveted on them" and that "they can't ever lead you astray." Benson said to follow them and have joy or reject them and suffer.
I'm glad that I make you sick though, because you're cult makes me deathly ill, as do those that defend it and refuse to even look at the truth, facts and reality. Even worse are those that learn the truth and facts and still defend the damn cult(Daniel C. Peterson) and its cult leaders like Gordon Bozo Hinckley.
By the way, I do have a life and it's helping people out of the Mormon cult of hell, and it's going quite well and they are very thankful to me and I greatly appreciate their support.
Your beloved missionaries lie to the people of the world every single day, when they spew their bullshit fairy tales that cause far more harm than good; by dividing up families into believers and non-believers and then pitting them against each other in a religious battle.
Maybe one day you can actually do some research and study, while mixing in some logic, common sense and decency and realize where Mormonism has come from, what it REALLY represents and the horrific adultery, racism and even murder it has perpetrated on the world.
Good luck in the cult and I hope you too can escape to freedom!!
Samuel
Oh yeah, to the uninformed and absolutely clueless poster, that thinks some member owns the malls and not the Mormon church....do you know how to Google? Have you been sleeping under a rock? Do you live on Kolob?
There is no doubt whatsoever as they've already had many press conferences here in Utah with the Presiding Bishop of the Mormon Church announced as the head of the construction project. There have also been countless news stories on Jesus Christ owned KSL TV and numerous newspaper articles in both the Salt Lake Tribune and Jesus' Deseret News. Like I said...GOOGLE!!
Oh yeah and I almost forgot; GORDON B HINCKLEY HAS TALKED ABOUT IT IN GENERAL CONFERENCE SEVERAL TIMES..Do you even watch general conference?!! Apparently not.
It's so widely known that the Mormon church owns these malls, that you are just embarrassing the shit out of yourself and showing your complete lack of knowledge.
If you would like the links, I will provide them for you, but do some homework, look on LDS.org and you'll find all you need to confirm this obvious fact, that your Mormon Jesus Christ now owns 2 malls, that are being re-built, that will allow the booze to flow Monday-Saturday.
They will be closed on Sunday, to "keep the Sabbath day holy", but it looks like the restaurants will probably be open on Sunday serving booze as well.
Before you start questioning others and calling them out; do a littler research so that you don't look so uneducated on the matter.
Isn't it just wonderful?!!
Samuel
Hey, Samuel. I've read your post and found it to be highly informative. It's both funny and sad (ironically... funny to those who can see through the B.S. and sad because there are those who never will) how these people keep shooting themselves in the foot with their decisions and comments.
Anyway, would you mind posting those links that you said you had? Not that I'm a terribly lazy person, but I just don't have the time to keep doing all this research while keeping up with my job and school studies.
Thank you, and please keep doing what you're doing. Though your in-your-face approach is highly effective, your rhetoric might be too intense and turn away those who can't take the profanity. You're doing a great job though... just thought I could give some advice.
I'm Mormon and I drink alcohol. Who cares? You're a nut.
You all take this too seriously! Come on, who cares? I drink, I'm a Mormon, I don't take myself too seriously and I don't take this religious stuff too seriously. All of you...you let it consume your life. That's too bad.
This is a very interesting website. I'm from England and in my ward a member of the stake presidency actually owns a restaurant that has a licence to sell alcohol and does. It also opens on Sundays, but is closed on Mondays. He has absolute approval of the church as long as he does not comsume alcohol himself. Many members including the bishop and other stake authorities actually attended the free opening night of his restaurant. This member, who, I must say is a lovely person, is also a temple worker and an officiator in the London Temple. I have always questioned how this can be - to preach the forbidness of alcohol and yet to to profit and pay tithes from this same "sin".
How can it be righteous to deliberately assist others in NOT receiving salvation? Remember every member is a missionary! In that case how can an alcoholic drink be served in one hand and the Book of Mormon given in the other hand? Remember that not being able to even keep the law of wisdom will result in NOT getting to the Celestial Kingdom and NOT ultimately being exhalted to live with Heavenly Father.
When applying for or renewing a temple recommend, if it is revealed that there is consumption of even the occasonal drink, the recommend will have to wait!
So is it okay to work towards the ultimate goal - the very essence of the church - the Celestial Kingdom and all that it entails for oneself whilst assisting others to sure damnation into a lesser kingdom?
This hypocrisy is just one drop in a huge ocean by this deceptive church!
I am still a member of the church but only because it suits me for the time being. I am lucky because I am completely immune to all it's "teachings and doctrines". It has no affect on me at all!
I rather be just a good citizen than follow some of the horrific examples I have seen displayed by members of all ranks of the "true church"!
how about you reserch all the other churches and the things they take part in, and then try and judge LDS. Mormons are the least hypocritical of them all. Trust me I know more then you about every thing you'r trying to say on this website of yours. Its just sad that you are no longer a member of the church, or you would know by the power of the holy ghost that there is nothing to worry about.
In answer to what you are saying person "anonymous", yes you are absolutely correct to point out that other churches partake of wrong doings and, in fact, gross hypocrisy in their past and their present. But remember as far as the LDS Church is concerned it is of no consequence or surprise because THE OTHER CHURCHES ARE NOT OF THE "RIGHT AUTHORITY"! You cannot have this argument as the other churches are NOT expected to do better as they are supposed to be apostate. Remember only through following LDS "teachings and doctrines can true salvation be obtained"! That is why there are websites like this one, because more is expected from the LDS Church. We are not talking about simple mistakes that men make, being only human - that would be acceptable. The crux of the matter is that one cannot keep on and on burying one's head in the sand when the barest of facts are staring you in the face!
An LDS member is even told to say at the pulpit "I KNOW THIS IS THE TRUE CHURCH". Now having said that and being taught that as often as possible, the LDS CHURCH HAS NO EXCUSE FOR PERPETUATING LIES FROM IT'S PAST AND PRESESENT! NO EXCUSE FOR PREACHING ONE THING AND BLATANTLY DOING ANOTHER! NO EXCUSE FOR PROFITING IN ANYWAY DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY THAT WHICH THE CHURCH DEEMS ALREADY IMMORAL! These are the things that make the LDS Church steeped in hypocrisy!!!
No amount of revelations can make up for this behaviour! 1,000,000% the General Authorities know and approve of what is going on, especially where big tithe payers are concerned. If this wasn't so, these people would not be allowed to still hold their positions in their wards and retain their temple recommend, et., etc.!
To be honest, the LDS Church is no better than any other church! It's a fact that people sooner or later must get used to. Just as in other churches their members are blinded by false and manmade doctrines, the same goes for the LDS Church.
Unfortunately, when research or blatant wrong doing is uncovered there will always be so much anger, pain and hurt for being lied to. This goes for any church or religion. But, yes, the LDS Church does set itself apart in such a way that because of it's "constant revelations" and "having a prophet here on the earth today", it cannot possibly be in error in anyway!
I could just write books on this subject, but you know what, I know what is expected of me to try to be a good citizen and hopefully be Christlike to my fellow human beings and animals with my humble failings. I was striving to be this way before I ever joined the LDS Church.
Even if it turned out there was no God or Jesus, there is no harm in "Christlike" ways! But that does not mean that I must be gullible or a fool! As I said before I am completely immune to everything they say and do! I do hope others can be like this too one day!
I am mormon and am 19 years old i was raised and brought up in the church.my mother and other members and bishops have taught me that this is the only true church BUT they have always encouraged me to find that truth out for myself. no one has ever pushed me into believing anything, i believe because i want to and know that it is true.the teachings,talks and quotes that you listed are true mormon doctrine on this site they do represent mormon teachings and where the mormon church stands on the alcohol issue. mormons live by the word of wisdom (no alcohol tea,coffee,tobacco,coke)mormons all know these commandments but are also taught free agency(the power to choose and make our own decisions for our selves)i have drunk alcohol before as a result of giving into peer presure ,but saying that no one forced the drink down my throat and i willingly accepted and drunk it.I no that it was not a great example i was setting if i was trying to be a rolemodel of mine and the mormon churches beliefs but i used my free will and made a bad decision and would hope that no one would label the mormon church hipocrytes based on my wrong actions and decisions.A decisiion that wasnt backed by the church or encouraged as you would have people believe.The church obviously does not encourage drinking alcohol or serving it to others but it is up to each member of the church to choose and use their own free agency.desicions made by members of the church are not for others to judge and critisize but we do realise and accept that ,that is what people do and we (although i can only speak for myself as these are my own personal opinions on my beliefs on what i have been taught in the church)we mormons need to set the best example we can to actually live the life of the teachings we preach .we are not expected by any means to be perfect only to do the very best we can based on our own personal circumstances.we are by no means as you say a cult i have two brothers and many family members who are not members of the mormon church who once were and still keep in concat with church members .we are not forced to believe or forced to stay in the church as you no or you obviously wouldnt be running this website today.mormons are not made to do anything they dont wish to do so i do not see how you could label the church a cult or for that matter evil.of course the church has people that stray away from there preachings sometimes but they are doing the best they can to live a good life and and be an example of what they believe. we are like everyoone else only human we make mistakes learn and grow from them. a teacher of mine once said to me when i myself had some questions about the behaivour of others in the church that ... "the church is always true,the people arent". its sad but true.
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